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[size=45][size=41]Al-Sudani denies the existence of any Iranian or American interference in forming his government[/size]
6 hours ago
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Prime Minister Muhammad Shia al-Sudani announced that Iraq and Saudi Arabia are able to establish a regional axis that will be a basis for stability in the region and the world, stressing the seriousness of the two countries in this matter. Al-Sudani revealed, in an interview with Asharq Al-Awsat, that he had agreed with Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman on a road map for developing bilateral relations, starting with ministerial visits, and then convening the Saudi-Iraqi Coordination Council to implement projects over a period of 3 years.
Al-Sudani confirmed, during an interview with Al-Sharq Al-Awsat newspaper, “Baghdad will continue to play its role in hosting the Saudi-Iranian dialogue, announcing a meeting soon, hoping that the level of security meetings will rise to the diplomatic level.
Al-Sudani denied the existence of any Iranian or American interference in forming his 100-day government, saying: “The government was formed by a 100% Iraqi decision, and it was not subject to any influence or interference in any way, direct or indirect.” Regarding the way Iraq deals with its two allies, the United States and Iran, whose relations are tense, Al-Sudani talked about Baghdad’s relationship with both countries, then said: “We do not want Iraq to be an arena for settling scores, and we are not a party to an axis against the other, as much as we care to strengthen our relations according to the rules of Common interests, mutual respect, and non-interference in internal affairs,” raising the slogan, “Iraq’s interest comes first.”
Al-Sudani stressed that "Iraq's pioneering role in the region is with its Arab brothers, as well as with Iran," saying that "Iraq's destiny is Arab, and this is the natural situation for Iraq." And he stressed the need to activate the "strategic framework" agreement between Washington and Baghdad, which "transfers the relationship between Iraq and the United States to the economic, cultural, social and educational fields, and does not remain limited to the security aspect, despite its importance."
The Iraqi Prime Minister spoke at length about the Iraqi internal situation and the measures taken by his government, “the citizens will begin to feel the results,” stressing the continuation of administrative and security reforms, combating the “pandemic of corruption” and recovering the looted funds, announcing the recovery of $80 million so far, and that the process is continuing.
Al-Sudani referred to the start of work on security reform and addressing the problem of unauthorized weapons, through a committee headed by him. Stressing that all political forces within the “state administration coalition” agreed to deal with the problem of uncontrolled weapons and “the necessity of security reform.” Weapons will only be within the framework of the security services established by law. There will be no weapon outside this institution.”
Regarding what is being reported about the problem of smuggling dollars from Iraq to Iran and Turkey, Al-Sudani said that currency smuggling takes place in all countries of the world and “Iraq is the same as other countries.” . He pointed to the involvement of Iraqi banks and banking companies in this matter and making large profits. He affirmed his optimism that the matter could be dealt with, and said, "In my estimation, it is the gateway to economic, financial, and banking reform in Iraq."
He emphasized working to address the relationship between Baghdad and Erbil, whether with regard to oil revenues or the security situation on the borders with Iran and Iraq, through an agreement that will be signed soon in Baghdad and with the approval of the Kurdish side. He also stressed that ISIS no longer poses any dangers, because it no longer holds the ground, and the Iraqi forces continue to chase its remnants.
Mr. President, after 100 days in power, are you optimistic or fearful, and I will not ask you if you regret accepting this difficult task?
I certainly did not regret it because I know the size of the task and the responsibility, and I accepted this assignment. God willing, I am optimistic. After 100 days, the government is clear in implementing its priorities at various levels. At the level of external relations, and at the internal level and its programs, whether in poverty alleviation or job creation, services, economic reforms and combating corruption. In every title, we have come a long way and established basic pillars for the implementation of this priority, and this is the goal that we have set in the government program.
Did this period confirm to you what you said earlier that corruption in Iraq is more dangerous than “Corona”?
That is why I called it the “pandemic of corruption.” It is the threat facing the Iraqi state, and it is more dangerous than “Corona” and “ISIS.”
You revealed something related to the “theft of the century.” First, I want to ask: How much money do you think was wasted after the overthrow of Saddam Hussein?
– The theft of “tax secretariats” I used to follow when I was a deputy, and after I was nominated (for prime minister), which was a long nomination period in light of the political uproar, I hoped it would be the first file I proceeded with, but it was opened before I started my mission. Unfortunately, most of the main suspects fled and contributed to getting the money out of Iraq, while a careful operation was supposed to be carried out to control this group that managed to steal an amount of this size.
How much do you estimate?
– The amount, according to the announced in the preliminary accounts of the regulatory authorities, is 3 trillion and 700 billion dinars (about 2.5 billion dollars), but our government, for the sake of more transparency and clarity and preserving public money, went to contract with an international auditing company, so that we stand on the number the real theft. As for the issue of wasting money since 2003, there are no accurate official readings or statistics. Corruption is diverse and has many forms, once it occurs in the operating budget, and once again it occurs in the investment budget, and sometimes outside the budgets; In decisions, financial and administrative corruption is called. There is corruption in an administrative decision, such as giving a piece of land to an investor who is not entitled to it, or preventing competition for an investment opportunity, monopolizing it, or limiting it to a person. But as I mentioned, corruption is a challenge that faces all state plans and programs to advance development and services.
It was said that the amount of wasted money amounted to 600 billion dollars in less than two decades?
Why not 700? Why not 500? These are estimates and numbers, but they do not give us the realistic picture. I told you that the regulatory authorities did not stand on a real number, nor can we (to give an accurate number), in the midst of this ramification of budgets and projects at the level of investment and investment plans. However, the thing that distinguishes this government in the fight against corruption is its insistence on recovering corruption funds. This is a clear loophole since 2003. What is the use of a sentence of 5, 10 or 15 years (imprisonment) for someone who stole trillions? Theft of “tax secretariats”, for example, if we want to imprison those accused of it, they will be imprisoned between 15 and 25 years, but we will incur 3.7 trillion (dinars) again, because the bulk of these guarantees have owners and they demand (them) from us. That is why we set the issue of recovering funds as a primary goal for the government's work, and funds began to flow in with recovery, some of which were looted before 2003, and the last of which was $80 million recovered through the procedures of the oversight bodies.
Was this money wasted before 2003?
- Yes.
Can the government recover money from the powerful?
By law enforcement, yes you can. According to Iraqi law, a citizen who fails or makes a wrong decision is referred, after proving his negligence, to an inclusion committee. No money included wasted. The employee pays the damage and does not get out of prison until it is paid. Now, we have started this process, and there are important names of politicians who have been arrested, and the money has begun to be recovered from them.
At what political level was corruption? Where did he get to?
Corruption, unfortunately, is at all levels. There is corruption of junior employees, and I am not exaggerating if I say that it is the most harmful, and this does not hide the opposition class. But we certainly cannot generalize corruption to everyone. There is an army of honest people who preserved public money and stood up to the corrupt, and we must stand by them and encourage them, otherwise if we keep repeating that everyone is corrupt, then this means an acknowledgment of the dominance of the corrupt in all the reins of affairs.
An army of corrupt and honest people
There is an army of corrupt and an army of honest people?
- The honest ones are more. Honest and patriotic people who took an honorable position to preserve public money based on their patriotism and love for their country, and God is more.
Is it reasonable for a rich country like Iraq to suffer from frequent power outages? Is this also caused by corruption?
Corruption, poor management and planning. In 2003, electricity production did not exceed 3,800 megawatts. Now, we have exceeded 21,000 megawatts. There is an expansion in growth and needs. The house used to have only a fan, now the whole house has air conditioners and various appliances. We have many problems. As I mentioned; Corruption, poor management and planning. At the end of 2013, we finished with the issue of electricity, but we got involved in (fighting) ISIS, so we went back. Sometimes administrative crises, and sometimes poor planning... Also, there is a remarkable issue in this sector, which is that electricity collection in all of Iraq does not exceed 10% or less.
What's the reason?
The reason, first, is the general culture that the state bears, and secondly, this interruption and poor service weakens the government side by demanding collections, as the “beneficiary” tells you to provide me with the service continuously until I pay the wages. According to the calculations of "Siemens", "General Electric" and Iraqi technicians, the value of waste and waste in electricity can solve the problem from its foundation. We do not have a culture of saving energy. When the electricity comes, the Iraqi citizen turns on all the air conditioners in order to cool his house.
Has the tax rate increased now?
Until yesterday, the collection amounted to 600 billion dinars (about 400 million dollars) only per year.
And how much should it be?
Billions are assumed. We only spend about $7 billion a year on the gas we import from Iran. And we buy electricity from investors, about $2.5 billion, in addition to oil derivatives and salaries. High cost and low tax.
eligibility for repair
Will we witness a deep state of reform in Iraq?
Today, reform has become an entitlement. When we talk about the economy, there is no way for us except economic reform and the development of sources of income. We cannot remain dependent on oil revenues to cover budget expenditures. Alternatives such as activating agriculture, industry and tourism are necessary. When we talk about administrative reform, the government job cannot remain the only source. We must reform these institutions and support the private sector in order to be supportive in generating job opportunities. When we talk about security institutions and overlap, we must go to security reform, and this is what we went to by forming a committee headed by us. So it is an individual not for consumption or an electoral slogan as much as it is an entitlement in the Iraqi situation, especially in this government.
How many employees, i.e. how much does the government pay salaries in Iraq?
– Up to 4 million employees, but there is a process to verify the number, and the number reached by the Ministry of Planning is 3.2 million, and there are still numbers to be added, in addition to the employees who have been confirmed, and they are in the range of 500 thousand.
install them?
Yes, they were working on contracts and were confirmed as permanent employees. I think the number is more than 4 million employees.
Is it true that the unemployment rate is 16% and the poverty rate is 25%?
Approximately these are the proportions. Poverty, according to statistics, is between 20% and 22%, and unemployment has increased according to indicators, especially in the past two years, due to the poor spending efficiency of the ministries to implement projects in the governorates, and the weak launch of investment projects from the private sector, because it did not receive the required support. This affected the level of unemployment, with the presence of graduates from all colleges as a result of a general tendency to education from the Iraqi family itself, in addition to the state that provided all requirements for higher education. This generated such a huge number of job seekers. In this government, we look at this challenge with several solutions, including government employment, and this we have finished with by virtue of the confirmation that took place. The second solutions relate to the private sector, which will be supportive of the government in generating job opportunities. We have an important law that will be voted on in the House of Representatives, and it is the pension, social security and workers law, and this law will equalize the rights of workers in the private sector with the government sector.
Will you make unpopular decisions in the next stage?
This government is destined to take reform decisions. Reform decisions are usually painful, but after a while, for sure, they will be beneficial for everyone.
Don't you fear for your popularity?
I fear primarily for the interest of Iraq and the people of Iraq. Before the interest of Iraq and its people, I do not (ask about) my popularity or my life. The interests of Iraq and the Iraqi people are my compass. If I see in this decision an interest for the country, I will follow it, but it is my responsibility to mitigate the harm, because any decision has harm to a group. All I care about is mitigating the damage to the poor and low-income class.
dollar smuggling
Mr. President, what is the problem of dollar smuggling that we are reading about?
After 2007, the Central Bank took a step that was correct, which is to address inflation and the anomalous situation of the Iraqi currency. Our relationship with the dollar began in the nineties, during the blockade period. Back then we were watching the dollar, when it went up, food prices went up. The central bank dealt with opening a window to sell the currency. The prevailing commercial mechanism, and it was supposed to get a review, is based on the merchant contacting an exchange company in order to import the materials. The exchange company is linked to private banks that are linked to the Central Bank. The greater part of this trade was not well defined. That is, not in accordance with the standards of compliance with the banking system. In it, there are inaccurate estimates of the price or quantity of the material, and the goal is for the merchant to obtain the largest possible amount of dollars in order to transfer them abroad, as the window for selling the currency in one year reached 300 million dollars per day.
Who sells it?
The central bank sells it to banks and companies. Banks transfer (dollars) abroad under import headings. It is not reasonable that there is a country that imports 300 million a day, unless it imports air and sells it to citizens. This mechanism was clear to everyone, from the US Treasury and the Federal Reserve and others. No one dared to confront this process, and we, deputies and analysts, were talking about it … until the Treasury Department came, as a matter of emphasizing the prevention of smuggling, money laundering, and other decisions of the United States towards some countries, to stress the dollar. I do not want to mention countries in the region, in the Gulf, from which dollars are forbidden from the United States. Don't give her a dollar.
countries in the Gulf?
- Yes. The issue for them is a sovereign and economic issue.
For whom?
- to the United States. She wants to be assured that her dollars are being sold in the right place and not going to places that she considers to be incorrect and against her interests. An agreement was reached between the two countries with Iraq adopting a new mechanism, to be implemented after two years, with gradation, actions and commitments, such as training banks, training merchants, and establishing an electronic platform, in preparation for the application of standards. Before I was commissioned, I found this information, so I asked the governor of the Central Bank: There is a mechanism that will be applied to banks and selling dollars, are you ready for it? He said: Yes, we are ready. But it turned out, in reality, after I started it - we have 3 months now - that it was not implemented. At the end of 2022, the mechanism began, that is, after the two years stipulated in the agreement signed between the two countries ended.
Nothing happened in those two years?
Nothing happened. The required measures to prepare the markets were not taken. That is, you are the owner of a bank, an exchange company, a merchant, and you have been working for 10 years according to a specific mechanism, and if you are asked to implement a new mechanism overnight, you will certainly object. Now, during this month, we're doing two years' work. We sit with the merchant and say to him: In order for your trade to be real, and most of them are real merchants and they want their trade to continue, you go through so-and-so, open a letter of credit, take an import license and receive the dollar, and so on… We have problems and I do not claim that our situation is ideal. We have no absolute control over the outlets. We have late tax regularity problems at customs, and routine notes in issuing an import permit...
Is there smuggling of dollars towards Turkey and Iran?
Currency smuggling continues in all countries of the world, and Iraq is the same as these countries. Many countries in the region are experiencing a collapse of their official currency, I do not want to go into the name, and they certainly need dollars, and this matter continues. Part of those involved with us are some banks and exchange companies at home, and they make large profits from selling dollars that are transferred to neighboring countries and countries in the region.
Optimistic about the possibility of treatment?
- Yes. This process, in my estimation, is the gateway to economic, financial and banking reform in Iraq.
Is there a solution soon to the problem of the deterioration of the Iraqi dinar?
– We started with a series of measures to reform the banking and financial situation in Iraq, in accordance with international standards, and at the same time there is a tendency to find out the reality of what the citizen needs of goods and services in accordance with the regulations and laws. The Council of Ministers for the economy, and the Council of Ministers has taken a number of decisions, and we are continuing to review with the private sector, banks, and the central bank, which is concerned with monetary policy, to keep pace with all the influences that accompany the process of price fluctuations. What we mainly care about, in the government, is maintaining the prices of basic materials and providing them at reasonable prices that do not burden the citizen, in addition to our continuous efforts with the private sector to overcome obstacles, according to those standards.
"strategic framework"
You received a call from US President Joe Biden, in which he affirmed his country's commitment to the strategic partnership, and an Iraqi delegation is preparing to visit Washington. What will you ask of America?
– Activating the “strategic framework” agreement, and this is what President Biden mentioned, and we support it. The "strategic framework" agreement that transfers the relationship between Iraq and the United States to the economic, cultural, social and educational fields... This is a clear agreement that was approved by the Iraqi parliament at the time, and we are supposed to implement it, and our relationship with the United States should not be limited to the security aspect only, despite its importance. But in these areas, the United States is a strategic partner for Iraq, and we can benefit from its companies and expertise in advancing the reality of our economy and all fields.
Does Iraq need America? Is there a conviction among the political forces that the relationship with America is necessary?
- The United States is a superpower, and Iraq - as you mentioned - is bound by agreements with it, and one of the most important agreements is the "strategic framework" agreement. We have cooperation in the field of combating ISIS... All political forces, in their conversations, confirm, in their speeches, that they are with Iraq's relations with all countries as long as they are in accordance with its interests. We have an interest in a relationship with the United States of America, there is no objection. We have an interest with the state "X" or "Y"... As I said, the compass is the interest of Iraq.
How does Iraq reconcile Iranian influence with the American role?
This is one of the problems that always arises, and we deal with it in the following way: First, Iran is a neighboring country with which we have many religious, cultural and social partnerships. Iran has stood with the political process from the beginning, and has also stood with us in the war against ISIS. Within this domain, we maintain this relationship. Certainly, there are many Iraqi political forces, from the various components of the Iraqi people, who also have positive relations with the Iranian side, as is the case with many countries in the region, and this is also a positive thing, but within the framework of non-interference in internal affairs, non-interference or influence on the national sovereign decision. This is what we see in our relationships and meetings. Everyone respects this form of relationship. With the United States, the United States contributed to the process of change after 2003. The United States was part of the international coalition that helped Iraq defeat ISIS. Today, the United States is also seen as a partner with whom we want to develop relations in other fields. Yes, there is a tense relationship between the United States and Iran, but certainly this will not be at the expense of Iraq. We do not want Iraq to be an arena for settling scores, and we are not a party to an axis against the other, as much as we care to strengthen our relations according to the rules of common interests, mutual respect and non-interference in internal affairs.
Iraq relations
Do you fear repercussions on Iraq due to the deterioration of Iran's relations with the West after the appearance of its weapons in Ukraine? That is, its (Iran's) relations with the Europeans recorded a significant decline?
In general, we tend to settle down. This stability will only come by drying up the hotbeds of tension. The Russian-Ukrainian war has an impact not only on Europe, but on the entire region. Our region is a sensitive area, and it needs more understanding, dialogue, and an end to interference. We do not support any intervention in any countries in any conflict situation, because this would exacerbate this crisis. The Russian-Ukrainian crisis could end if interventions from all countries of the world cease, so that we resort to pushing the two sides to dialogue. Dialogue is the best way to avoid the tragedies of these countries and the region. Iraq suffered from the fire of wars and blockades and knows its impact. Therefore, we are talking about this logic, because without the logic of dialogue, crises cannot end, and the principle of interventions will prolong any crisis.
Were you asked to mediate in the Russian-Ukrainian crisis, whether by Russia or America?
We take our position according to our vision, conviction and principles. And as I mentioned, Iraq is the country that suffered from wars and sieges. What we do not accept for our own internal affairs, we certainly do not accept for all countries of the world.
There is no excuse for failure
Mr. President, you are the first Iraqi prime minister since 2003 to head a government in which the Sadrist movement is absent. Is there a truce with the Sadrist movement? what deal? Are you afraid that the economic suffering will either lead to an uprising like the one that took place (the youth uprising), or that the “Sadr movement” will take to the streets?
The “Sadr movement” is a broad political movement with a well-known leadership and an active role in the political process, whether it is present in parliament and the government or outside the parliament and government. We respect his decision to withdraw from Parliament, and we care about his presence in the political work, and for him to exercise his role in criticism and pointing out any negative situation within the legal and constitutional framework.
As for the issue of whether we fear an uprising or such or such from the “current” or from the youth or others, any failure, God forbid, in implementing our government program and in implementing our priorities that we committed to before the people, will certainly be rejected by all components of the Iraqi people and not by this political party. or that. The current situation does not tolerate this failure, so the “State Administration Coalition”, which formed this government and includes 280 deputies from various components - including the “Coordination Framework”, “Kurdistan Union” and “Sovereignty and Resolve” - is concerned and responsible for this stage with all its advantages. And its negatives, and it has no excuse before the rest of the parties, whether it is the "Sadr movement", the youth, or the vast majority of the Iraqi people. You know, no more than 60% participated in the elections.
I mean, we must look at the 60% before we look at the rest of the political components. If these 60% are not satisfied with the performance, they will certainly have a position.
60% of those eligible to vote in the recent parliamentary elections did not participate?
Yes, official estimates indicate a clear reluctance to participate in the elections, reaching around 60%.
Is this because the political forces disappointed the people?
This is one of the important reasons. After the election results were announced and the political forces entered a vortex for a year, the validity of the 60% decision was confirmed. This 60% said to the 40%: Look, we told you that the operation is useless.
Mr. President, is the "coordinating framework" still satisfied with the directions of your government?
– Certainly, the “coordinating framework” is the largest bloc of the Shiite component, and it is the one that adopted the nomination of the prime minister, and has ministers from all its parties, and went to an agreement with the rest of the blocs and formed the “state administration coalition.” The success or failure of the government, God forbid, is borne by the "framework", the government and the "state administration coalition". The question of unease or unease, I think, is a metaphor. We go to the platform. There is a ministerial platform and program, in which the general guidelines for all files have been discussed and agreed upon. Whenever we implement this program or ministerial curriculum, we measure the extent of acceptance or rejection. As for outside of this, I am not concerned.
Fear of success
How do you see the political process since 2003 until now?
It seems that in the political process, from 2003 until now, there is a fear of success. This is not logical.
Fear of success since 2003?
Yes, yes, part of the political implications that occurred is that some fear success. We faced many obstacles. There were projects that could contribute to alleviating the suffering of citizens and make governments succeed, but they were aborted for fear that this or that government would succeed. I hope that we have finished and transcended this obsession, because its survival will impede any government, whatever its orientations, aspirations, and program. In my estimation, all those present now are keen on the success of the government, and everyone supports, senses the danger, and clearly recognizes that this is an important opportunity and a last chance, and if it is not invested, then they have no excuse before the people.
Can there be a major collapse if the current government fails?
- God willing, it will not happen, because the sources of strength in Iraq are present and control the reins of affairs.
State rights
It was said that the Iraqi state was distributed among components and factions, with security, economy, and everything. Is this true? Will we see Iraq as a state recovering its rights from the components and factions?
First, there is a kind of lack of clarity. We are talking about a coalition government. A coalition government is usually formed from the political forces present in Parliament. Political forces have the right to exist in the government. We are a coalition government that represented the political forces present in Parliament, and I was keen to have ministers nominated from their parties according to criteria I set. Each party nominates three for me and I choose the minister.
Did they force you?
Never, never, and I bear the choice of the entire cabinet.
Every political force gave you 3 names?
Give me filters. There is a political bloc that gave me 6 candidates. I reject two, I reject three, I reject four, until I reached what I was convinced of.
What were your criteria? What is integrity?
Integrity, efficiency, access to the Ministry's file, and some specifications. I chose this booth, and here the confusion began and the talk about the security services and institutions. I say: I want one name, I want an order issued according to which we were given a sensitive security position for a political party or a security faction or such… Just confusion.
Didn't it happen?
It did not happen and will not happen. The security services will not be managed in the Sudanese government except through the people of the security establishment. a dot on the line. The financial institution will only be managed by professionals from this institution. And by the way, and to be honest, the political forces did not demand any party for a security site. They respected this decision and they all supported it unanimously. In the State Administration Coalition, there was talk about the security establishment, and I gave my point of view, and they said: We all support this decision. I go back and say, whoever proposes, let him tell me where is the security authority that we gave to a faction, militia, party, or something like that?
Saudi experience
Let's move on to another matter... A few days ago, you met with the Saudi Foreign Minister, Prince Faisal bin Farhan. How would you describe the relationship with Saudi Arabia now?
Praise be to God. It is a good and cumulative relationship since the previous governments, and everyone is keen to perpetuate this relationship for a logical reason, which is the weight of Iraq and Saudi Arabia on the Islamic, Arab, economic and geographic levels, and the commonalities between us that can easily be a political and economic axis centered in the region and establish a stable regional system and be a pillar. One of the pillars of stability in the world.
Can you, with Saudi Arabia, establish a regional axis that will be the basis for stability in the region and the world?
Yes, for a regional system that will be the basis for the stability of the region and the world: economically, politically, geographically, and by all criteria. Iraq and Saudi Arabia are able to create this axis to be a focal point in the region and the world, and we are serious about that. I had a conversation with His Highness, Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman, and I found him responsive as usual and moving forward to achieve this goal with clarity and serious desire. We set an agenda between us, during my participation in the Arab-Chinese summit, for mutual visits. The visit of the Minister of Foreign Affairs took place, followed by the visit of the Minister of Commerce, the Chairman of the Coordination Council.
where?
- in Baghdad. Our ministers also visited Saudi Arabia. The meetings are now alternated until we prepare for the session of the Iraqi-Saudi Coordination Council in Baghdad or Riyadh. There is no problem. In the Coordinating Council, we will present a schedule of tasks and projects for a period of 3 years, with timelines.
Agreed on that with the crown prince?
Yes, we agreed on that in Riyadh.
Was this the first time you met Prince Mohammed bin Salman?
No, I met him more than once as a minister.
as prime minister?
The first time, during the Arab-Chinese summit, and we held bilateral talks.
How is your opinion of what Saudi Arabia is witnessing?
An experience that deserves respect and the exchange of experience. The Kingdom of Saudi Arabia has made significant strides in investing its resources properly at the economic level. When I was Minister of Industry, I saw this experience, and it is a pioneering experience. I visited Ras al-Khair, Jubail, and Riyadh, and I was briefed on the essence of the Saudi industry and found it advanced and contributing to securing a large proportion of the global market needs. This experience is worth sharing experiences with siblings. Also on the political level, Saudi Arabia today has an important role, and the Arab-Chinese summit conference was a step in the right direction, and it is important for us as Arabs and the countries of the region, and we must contribute to reducing tensions and extinguishing crises in the region because we raise the slogan of development, and development needs stability, and the files in the region And the world, are economic files. The visions are identical.
Do you have an open line in a personal relationship?
- Yes Yes.
The Saudi-Iranian dialogue
Do we expect a new round of Saudi-Iranian dialogue in Baghdad soon?
- hopefully. Soon, we will achieve this encounter. Since the beginning of the government's work, and at the request of the brothers in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia and Iran, we want this relationship to continue, and we see it as a necessity, because the divergent viewpoints in the region whenever they converge, they reflect stability.
In a week or more?
Discussions or contacts are continuing to arrange meetings, and they already exist at some levels, but we want their level to rise. Our goal is to raise the level of meetings from security officials to diplomatic relations under the auspices of Iraq.
Will you personally participate in these meetings?
Yes, yes, I follow her personally.
Did Turkish-Arab dialogues take place in the past in Baghdad, or only the Saudi-Iranian dialogue?
- I think security coordination. In the matter of security, we are keen to have coordination with all the countries of the region, given the experience gained by our security agencies and their ability to detect many terrorist plots, and we are interested in sharing this information with the countries of the region.
like who?
- with everyone. Egypt, Jordan, the Gulf states, Iran and Turkey, even with European countries. Our security services have the ability to penetrate and dismantle terrorist groups.
Don't you worry about ISIS?
No, ISIS is just a terrified gang fleeing in its burrows. We target them daily with strikes in all locations. They cannot hold the land, but rather they are small groups that do not exceed 4-5 people, moving in operations targeting citizens or sites, and the work is continuing to track down and pursue these terrorists.
Did the devices detect an attempt to target you?
No, there is no such attempt.
The elusive weapon
There is a problem called “uncontrolled weapons.” Where has the state gone in dealing with this phenomenon?
In our battle with ISIS, we were looking for anyone who could bear arms, so let him take up arms. The existence of ISIS was targeting innocent citizens, villages, cities and neighborhoods, and it created fighters with formations with different titles. After the victory, the previous governments did not make an effort in the security reform process. There are Security Council resolutions related to the need for security reform in order for security institutions to be professional and work according to contexts. We're getting started. Today, I issued a decision to form a committee, headed by me, to adopt security reform in the security institutions. One of the most important priorities of this reform is the control of weapons within the framework of the security institutions according to the law, i.e. there is no weapon outside the security institutions.
Wouldn't there be a weapon outside the security institutions?
This is in agreement with all the political forces in the platform and in the political agreement. Weapons within the framework of the security services established by law. There will be no weapon outside of this institution.
Will you confiscate it?
– Through confiscation, through dialogue, to end all these problems. The important problem is that there are those who link the issue (carrying arms) to the presence of foreign parties. There are parties that believe that there is a foreign presence, and that they believe that no foreign presence should be allowed outside the law and the constitution. This is a view supported by many Iraqis. If we organize this presence within the constitutional and legal framework, there will be no excuse for these people.
How would you describe your relationship with the Kurdistan Region after what was said about the problem of remittances?
We started with a road map to solve the problems between Baghdad and Erbil, starting with financing previous budgets. We collided with the Federal Court's decision and headed to another procedure within the law and within the powers. We are on the cusp of submitting the budget, and we have reached an agreement with the region on the form of oil management and the financing of financial allocations in the budget law. After approving the budget, we will go to the legislation of the oil and gas law, and this is one of the most important tasks since the writing of the constitution after 2003, because oil and gas are not only waiting for the region, but all the oil-producing governorates are waiting for it. They want to know their powers and what they return to them.
Is this a Kurdish demand?
An Iraqi demand. But because of the oil problems, the issue appeared as if oil only solves the region's problems with the center. We are heading to implement this scenario, the rest of the problems are controlled within the powers and procedures. Our conviction is that our national responsibility includes all citizens in all geographical areas in Iraq, whether the citizen is inside the region in Erbil, Sulaymaniyah, Anbar, or Najaf. This is the legal and moral situation. We are keen to take care of all the people in a way that preserves the principle of justice and equality, and the social contract that unites us is the constitution.
Will the Arab summit be held soon?
- Yes. But the date has not been set yet. The decision to hold the Arab summit, only remains to set the date. I think in Riyadh.
Will Syria attend this summit?
We hope that Syria will come. The time has come for us to work seriously to return Syria to its seat and presence in the Arab League. There must be an understanding because the stability of Syria is the stability of the region. If there is a threat of terrorist activity against Iraq, it comes from the Syrian border. Any unstable situation in Syria comes to Jordan, Lebanon and the countries of the region. It is very important that there be a dialogue with the Syrian government in a way that alleviates the suffering of the Syrian people, who have been suffering for a long time and are now living in difficult living and economic conditions.
Border security
Iran has accused some of what it called groups in Kurdistan of playing a role in facilitating the attack on Isfahan. Are you concerned about any major Iranian action in Kurdistan?
This is one of the problems that the government faced during this period, the attacks that took place on the Iraqi-Iranian border, and on the Iraqi-Turkish border as well. It was subject to discussion and dialogue between the two countries, and the direction was towards concluding or signing a joint report in a joint security committee in which the region and federal agencies are present with the Iranian side so that we carry out 3 tasks:
The first is to hold the borders from federal official forces.
The second, the extradition of wanted persons in accordance with legal orders.
Third, not allowing any party to set up a camp or have weapons.
You, as an opposition party, exist as a refugee, under Iraqi laws.
You mean the Kurdistan Workers Party?
Yes, the PKK or the opposition Democratic Party of Iran. This presence is old, but in the capacity of a refugee and not in the capacity of a camp, weapons and training, as shown by satellite channels.
Did the region agree to receive federal forces?
Yes, we are in the process of an agreement, and a delegation from Iran will come to sign the agreement in Baghdad, and we held a meeting for this committee, in order to preserve the borders, and the legal framework is sufficient to prevent any drag into violence.
Are there relations at a high level with Syria?
Within the official framework.
Didn't you visit Syria?
- no.
Doesn't anyone come from Syria to Baghdad?
Since I started until now no one has come. Only meetings with the ambassador.
How do you see the situation in Lebanon?
Certainly the situation in Lebanon makes us anxious because of the economic repercussions as well as the political instability. This is the case we went through in Iraq. All our efforts and endeavors to urge all parties to reach an understanding, elect a president of the republic and form a government so that they face the economic entitlements that have burdened the Lebanese people in these difficult circumstances. We are open and ready for all forms of cooperation and support.
Do you help with something?
Yes, there was fuel insurance, and we are continuing. Our government is committed to this matter.
Saddam Hussein's chair
Mr. President, you are sitting on a chair on which Saddam Hussein and Abdul Salam Aref sat before you... What does an Iraqi feel when he sits in Saddam Hussein's place in the same headquarters?
- First, this is the year of life that brings "S" or "Y" to this great responsibility in a country facing these entitlements. Whoever sits on the chair must take lessons from those who sat, where they went, how they went, and what they left... These must be present in front of him, and the day will come when he leaves this chair, but what does he leave?
You are 50 years old, Bekir.
- 50, 60, 70, 100 You will leave this chair, but God Almighty gave you the opportunity to serve your people, to be in this position, in these circumstances, your question and your standing before God will be long and the question differs from what a simple citizen faces, because I will be responsible for the decision economic security, social living. I have a great responsibility and I take great care and work daily for up to 17 hours, and I do not differentiate between days, and I do not know this day as Friday, Thursday or Saturday, by virtue of the continuous schedule, to the extent that I exhausted those around me, especially since I am very annoying at work. This is all because this is a responsibility, and I myself come from this community. I was a student at the College of Agriculture at the University of Baghdad from 1989 to 1992. I used to work at night in Hamada Market.
Your experience in official and political work is long, what are its stations?
– I lived in the eighties, and I lived in the nineties, I lived through the siege, I lived after 2003 in political work. I stick with the people in all stages. I am the only Iraqi prime minister after 2003 who lived with the Iraqis from the eighties until after 2003 and the political process, and the only one who was included in positions. I come from the state system, an employee in 97, and after 2003 a district commissioner, council member, governor, minister, and several ministries.
Are you now outside the "Da'wa Party"?
Yes, I resigned in 2019.
Didn't you leave bitterness with the party?
No, I was clear with them. The Dawa Party is an ancient party and has a system. Mistakes even among the media, they come and say: You are a leader in the "call". What is the word leader?
I mean, you didn't have a responsibility to "call"?
- Never, I am just the son of a martyr of the “Da’wa”, so I was appointed in the elections, meaning my candidacy, and the “Dawa” party in the elections was directing its supporters that Muhammad Shiaa al-Sudani, by virtue of his social weight as a clan sheikh, my family is the sheikhs of a clan, the tribe of Sudan, he will win, so if you have Supporters ask them to vote for him. The Dawa Party gave me an opportunity, nominated me in the State of Law, nominated me as a minister. And I, praise be to God, reflected a performance, and the “Dawa” party says that it has a competent and honest minister.
Did you know Qassem Soleimani or did you meet him?
- in general meetings. He used to come in official delegations to the ministries, and a meeting would take place.
Has Iran supported your government?
Iran never interfered in the negotiations to form the government.
Didn't Qaani review you?
- never.
Or the American ambassador?
Not even the American ambassador. The government was formed by a 100% Iraqi decision, and was not subject to any influence or interference in any form, direct or indirect. For 8 years I was a minister, in the second government of Mr. (Nuri) al-Maliki, and in the government of Mr. (Haider) al-Abadi. I did not receive an order neither from a political side, i.e. the party that nominated me, we want such or such from you, nor from an international political side. This agreement is in our interest or harm us.. never. Much of what is rumored is not accurate.
The Iraqi is proud of his Iraqiness, personality, position and principles, and no genuine Iraqi can give up his decision to any party.
Arab depth
Your talk about the depth of the Arab does not bother Iran?
- never. Never, it does not cause embarrassment, nor does the Iranian side have a problem with this matter. Iraq is a country of Arab depth and a pioneering position for hundreds of years. This is our natural role, and we are proud to exercise it with ease, because this would contribute to the stability of the region, including the Arab countries and neighboring countries, whether Iran or Turkey.
What about linking interests with the Gulf? Have you discussed this with them (the Iranians)?
Yes, at the highest level. at the highest levels. Iraq's pioneering role in the region with its brothers, with its economy, is something important for Iraq in the first place and for the bilateral relations between Iraq and Iran.
Do you think that the fate of Iraq is Arab?
Yes, yes, the destiny of Iraq is Arab, and this is the normal situation for Iraq. And Iraq does not assume a role that is not its role. His role since creation is the pivotal role.
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